It’s been a while since we’ve done an open thread, huh? Today I want to talk about community. One of my blindspots as an agent is the world of online writing groups, message boards, discords, reddits, hashtag organized pitch events, beta readers and the like. I’ve always been part of a writing community, but mostly because I’ve always been surrounded by writers. And I’m an Old, so I was already in college by the time I had the internet at home and I didn’t find myself deep in a fandom or fic or tumblr or whatever. Twitter? Yes. But I wasn’t there to build community the same way an up-and-coming writer might be. I didn’t want to infiltrate those spaces switching my agent hat for my writer hat, because I didn’t want to be a narc and/or I didn’t want that to become the focus when people found out I was an agent. I was invited to my current writing group by a friend over seven years ago. (!!!!!) Same with my book club, but this was almost 20 years ago (!!!!!!!!!!). I have sent my novel(s) to friends to read, which is the definition of beta reader, but it didn’t feel like the same relationship others have with that title. SO! As I set out to revise my book, I need to learn more about community. Tell me about your writing community. Where is it? How’d you find it? How long did it take for you to feel comfortable in it? Are you a beta reader? How does that work for you? Is it hard to keep your community organized? Does one person do all the work? (Are you that person lol?) Have you struck out looking for community? What has surprised you most about finding or not finding community? Are you in any IRL writing communities? Does it feel like getting picked last for dodgeball all over again? Did you join something established or did you have to build it yourself. If you built it, did they come?
If you want to keep your community under wraps, feel free to withhold your group’s identifying details. And who knows, I might quote you in my book. (I’ll let you know if I’m doing that.) Thank you for letting me use this community to learn more about communities.
I signed up for some online writing courses during Covid and miraculously, organically, out of that virtual space, found two great writing companions, which then developed into a writing group. We've been meeting more or less montly for more than 2 years. It's amazing. The people in the group are better writers than I am, and have published fiction (I've only published academic books thus far), and that's great: it's like learning to play tennis, right? It helps to play with someone who can hit the ball back & whose skills are aspirational but achievable (ie: I don't want to play tennis with Serena Williams b/c obviously). But I also have been in groups that have been disastrous, in that there were wildly different expectations & energies, so it felt like a chore rather than an opportunity. It seems, though, like aspiring writers are starved for community, given the number of (frequently expensive) workshops, online courses, retreats, and etc. And those purveyors of community aren't always necessarily on the up-and-up... But having a sense of belonging really, really helps.
For a while, I had a super hard time finding an online writing group that had people who were actually writing. Loads of them exist where people talk about writing or talk about their book idea endlessly without ever actually writing. Luckily, I stumbled into a discord by pure chance after I attended a writing seminar from a well known author. After the talk, she was kind enough to link everyone to a message board she'd set up. The message board was for writers to share ideas, maybe find crit partners, etc, but off of it, someone posted a link to a writing discord and that was it. Somehow that was the perfect group. Everyone in it was super motivated, super committed to the craft, into learning, and writing so much! Now we're all very close ride or die kind of friends. We've had in-person retreats twice now (a third planned for this year), crit one another's works, have book clubs, and all around support each other in getting drafts done, getting agents, being on submissions, working through plot stuff. Any and everything. I feel fantastically lucky to have found this group.
I found my beta reader/ writer group through Bianca Marais, https://www.biancamarais.com/beta-reader-match-up.html there are 6 of us writing the same genre. We formed a Discord server and we chat, share the terrors and glories of querying and swap chapters and full manuscript reads. They are the best. I have also found a beta reader through an online class, she is writing in my niche so we connected up via email.
I'm in the same boat! I've done a couple of Bianca's groups, and they've been helpful to find kindred spirits in my same genre / target age category. Another benefit: participants generally have a goal of finishing and revising (and often publishing or self-publishing) a work, so we can commiserate about the total process.
The best writing community I've found (for fiction and nonfiction) is George Saunders' Substack Story Club. I've never been in a writing community where 1) the "instructor" (for lack of a better word) is so clear and insightful and open-minded, and can actually lead you through the writing process, 2) ALL the comments are additionally so helpful and validating (and there are so many of them!), and 3) all the advice can ACTUALLY CHANGE YOUR WRITING. The whole group is so kind and empathetic. It's remarkable. I recommend it all the time.
I will now tell you a short story about building community, but this one isn't about a writers group. It's about a diagnosis. On March 4th, I received a phone call from my dermatologist. I'd been in to her office the week before for a regular skin check, something I'd done every 5 years since I was a child. Born fair, freckled and spotted with moles, having grown up in sunny climates... I am a poster child for skin cancer awareness. Before this year, I never got a phone call. It was always a form letter stating the results of the biopsy and how they were non-cancerous. But this time, it was a phone call and the diagnosis was melanoma.
Even through the shock and fear, I knew I was going to need some help. I was going to need surgeries, rides to & from hospital, a comforting shoulder to turn to and someone to talk me off the cliff I kept finding myself tumbling down. I told myself it was OK to feel all the feelings. It was OK to take naps, and not think for a while. It was OK to mourn my old life and the body parts I might lose. It was OK to envision a new way of living, that involved less sun, more screen. But, I was going to have to find my people. I had to find melanoma specialists in my area, I was going to find the people who would give me support and put their own drama aside for a minute, I was going to have to ask for help and that was not something I was good at, asking for help - I was the person others went to for help. I learned that others may not know how to help and so it is imperative to be clear: I need a ride. I need someone to mow my lawn. I'd love some soup. I need a hug. I think this is true no matter the community that one is trying to form or fit in with; you need to be clear about your needs and objectives, you may have to articulate that to the people who show up because they might not know what you need.
I’ve always been an avid reader, and writing is a late-in-life passion project for me after years of being an accountant. I started from scratch, having an interesting idea for a novel, but not really knowing how to write creatively. I’m lucky to live in Seattle where the writing community thrives. Many independent bookstores hold author events that are free to the public, and it’s one of the best ways to show support. As a bonus, I began bumping into the same people, many of whom are writers themselves. I also attend writer conferences and continuing education classes, finding serious writers who are interested in honing their craft and sharing what they’ve learned. It can be a slow process, because established writer groups are hesitant to add members, but new groups are forming every day, and it’s pretty simple to start one of your own, especially if you’re willing to host. These connections lead to beta readers, but there’s an unwritten agreement you’ll become one as well, which takes time. I’ve learned much about my own writing by beta reading other’s work. And, most recently, I’ve beta read for established authors, which is like taking a masters class. Currently, I’m a member of two writing groups. Each meets in person once a month, and one is for critique and the other for timed writing. I also belong to a group on FB that’s for accountability and meets every Sunday morning. All of this took way longer than I originally thought it would, but, oh my gosh, I feel more fulfilled than I ever thought possible!!! ♥️
I first found a writing community in my MFA program, Solstice MFA in Creative Writing Program, now at Laselle University (https://www.lasell.edu/graduate-studies/academics/mfa-in-creative-writing.html). I know that's not everyone's experience, but the director of that program, Meg Kearney, built the program with community as a guiding principle (Here's a piece I wrote in my Accidental Mentors series about Meg's philosophy: https://www.annettemarquis.com/p/learning-to-write-is-a-collective). It made all the difference for me. In fact, I continue to be involved in the community, more than ten years later. I'm going back for a week long retreat during their summer residency this July. I can't wait. After I graduated, I went to work for a local writers organization, James River Writers (https://jamesriverwriters.org/). It, too, sees community as its major mission: "James River Writers (JRW) builds community by connecting, supporting, and inspiring writers and lovers of the written word in central Virginia and beyond." Both experiences have taught me that I need to be in a community of other writers. It makes me a better writer, more engaged with my craft, and encouraged and motivated to keep writing. I couldn't write without them.
The Muse, my favorite local writer's center, has a ton of resources and links to other communities (https://the-muse.org/writers-resource/). I found that center in grad school and taught there later, and they are open and thoughtful people who continue to grow the community both onsite and online. There are some people who are more impressed with themselves than those around them, but they're thankfully few and far between. For the most part, everyone loves writing as art and it's wonderful to be in that vibe. My grad school cohort is the other core of my writing community even if we're not constantly in touch, it's nice to know there's help for each other when we need it.
So interesting to see all the different examples. I joined a paid (~$150/month) online writing workshop in 2021 that's specific to the romance genre. I was skeptical that it would be worth the money, but I've found it not only to be a helpful community to workshop pieces in, but also to find community with writers in a similar stage as me (debut romance writers who have not yet published and largely haven't yet queried). I do think there's been a lot of value in working with writers within my genre, given the common tropes, unique structure and expectations readers have in romance. I think if (once?!) I get representation, I might leave the group but I could see myself trying to spin out a writing group with a few writers at a similar stage to me to remain connected. Writing is so solitary, that just having folks to debrief the psychology of writing and the blockers involved has been really valuable to me.
I was so inspired by reading Natalie Goldberg's Writing Down the Bones in college that shortly after graduation, I stuck a note on the local hippie bookstore's cork board calling for writers to join me for a group like the one she describes in the book. A few people answered the call (and subsequent classified ads-- so old school!) to free write at a coffee shop for two hours every week and read aloud without judgment or apology. We have paused a few times (when I went out of state for my MFA, when I joined the Peace Corps) but the core group is still going strong. We shifted to Zoom during COVID and pulled in a few out of state members, including one who first joined us as a high school student nearly 30 years ago. It's magic!
I’m actually in the trenches of this now. I have a BA in creative writing but took a different path than my classmates and lost touch. Years later, I’ve found my way back to writing fiction and am building my new community from scratch. I found my first few writer friends via Substack (yay!) and after some trial and error with groups, I applied for (and got into) a year-long course/workshop that starts next week. It’s not cheap, and I expect it to be pretty intensive (which is what I want.) The group has an email chain going already where we are introducing ourselves and our projects, and it feels like maybe I’ve found my people. (I hope they like me lol)
As to Beta readers, I always recommend that writers use them before paying a content or structure editor (my day job). I maintain that Beta readers can point out plot holes and character issues which will make the ms atronger by the time I read it. So everyone wins.
Almost twenty years ago, when I was still working for a publisher, a work friend and I had lunch, and both of us expressed interest in joining a writing group. I said "we should just start one" and so we did.
We've lost and gained a couple of writers but we're still going strong. The members came to my book launch in January--joining other friends and family, of course--and what a full circle moment that was.
I'm in two other writing communities, both spawned by conferences. I find a great deal of support, even when it's all virtual...but especially when we all reunite, once a year or more.
My writing community centres around the Poetry Society Derby Stanza group and an International poetry group (both of which I run). I also have a broad range of connections thanks to my anthology publication work with Coverstory books. Hoping comes of Substack, but there are lots of voices here! Seeking a new in-person group where we are now living (Market Rasen, UK), and may just have to set one up myself!
Once I got back into freelance work, I developed connections in the news business. When I tried finding community in creative writing in my area I found myself locked out by the local queen bee. I didn't kiss up enough to her, and she was a gatekeeper. But I started out by offering manuscript swaps anyway. Then I enrolled in an MFA, and we now have a wonderful alumni network to read, edit, and hype each others' work. And it all took a long time--24 years or so.
Those queen bees can be a pain. Just had a run in with one this weekend. Tempted to escalate—there’s the danger of writing fiction, always looking for drama—buuuut, stood down. Glad you ditched her and found a better group.
The upside of having booked the entire summer at a lake, is time alone to write. The downside of having booked the entire summer at a lake, is time alone to write. I sure miss my writing friends, the walks we take to shore each other up, to encourage each other to keep going, and reassure each other that rejection means you're a real writer. Tonight, as I dine alone, I'll toast the writing communities that keep us going when it all seems just so hard.
I have participated in a few writing groups, usually without success. Either one or two people dominate the discussion, or they are condescending to those who write in different genres from them. But I believe writing communities are important, so that a writer doesn’t feel so alone. I won’t give up. Like relationships, one will come along when it is right.
I had met Elizabeth Gaffney through A Public Space. Started her Novel workshop right as Covid hit. She turned the workshop online. From that she created The 24hourroom.org. An online community with slow readings, craft conversation. I found a vibrant writing community. Great writers. Great people.
I’ve found some community in groups like WFWA and in online classes I’ve taken. My history in writing was based in journalism so when I decided to go into fiction, I had to find new community. I’m still looking for good beta readers who’d like to trade work.
I am late to the discussion, but I’m curious if others have had similar experiences with writing communities online. It seems like when you are engaged on the platform at least daily, your community is alive and well. But if you take some time away, it feels like FOMO and those connections shrivel. People “move on” without you. The social algorithms don’t help with this, of course, and unfortunately (or fortunately?) my mental health is best when I’m not plugged into socials all the time. I’ve found the most “sticking” community through my local SCBWI chapter and an online novel intensive course - places where I have met people on video or in person. Not sure if the “face to face” makes the connection/community stronger, but that seems to be the trend for me. Probably all comes down to personal preference!
I feel like my writing community is actually a bunch of communities: online, IRL, and in-between (texting threads mixed with Zoom). It's a patchwork quilt that keeps me warm, made up of scraps from my journey--a critique group that started from another; and so on. There is no organizing them. There is only me, flitting between them, and enjoying what is unique about each--knowing what I go to that one place for and honoring that, and doing the same for each.
CLUBHOUSE! I signed up in 2020 and from listening and speaking with the Indie authors I realised it is possible to make a living from writing books. I am now a full-time author as a result. The Author Conference is at 2pm CET every week day (it is mostly writers in the US having their morning coffee!) It's where 6-7 figure authors and start up writers get together and discuss topics about publishing, marketing, etc. There is a room that follows it Writers Tribe Morning Chat. There are daily writing sprint rooms, weekly online meetups for; social media for authors, crime authors, cozy mystery, historical fiction. Anyone can join in the discussions. Best to join and just listen for the first few times and don't feel overwhelmed you'll soon get to know everyone and feel part of the group. :)
Weirdly, one of my best communities was someone who made a Google doc and said they were putting together writing groups on Twitter. We’ve been meeting every two weeks for two years and it’s been awesome. One of us even became an agent in that time. They actually rep one of us now. I got my agent in 2023, and the others are just trying to keep writing going in their lives but it’s been a really great group. I also have one in-person, but they are mostly poets. Great company though.
In case you haven't heard, Blackbird Writers is an awesome community of 24 authors (there's only room for 4 and 20!) all flying under the Mystery umbrella. We are Cozy, Comic Cozy, Romantic suspense, Thriller, Police Procedural and more. We all support each other's news and events and have a weekly blog. Feel free to check us out here on Substack, or visit www.blackbirdwriters.com. Thanks!
I started a group with several friends that I learned were secretly also working on their writing and feeling like it wasn’t going anywhere, like me! We’ve only had 3 meetings so far but they’ve been extremely encouraging and healing ❤️ the hardest part is of course scheduling — we’ve been doing weekends for work schedules but that means a lot of the days get canceled in the summer months as people are on trips etc, still gotta figure that out!
Thank you, Kate, for your thoughts, and for cheering us on.
I finally had to give up on trying to find a group of writers. I do write, profusely, every day, and I publish every week on Substack. If the comments are any indication, I am going the right way.
I am a veteran, anyway, having spent my entire career in a newsroom, editing, and writing. One thing you learn there is that you have to write on deadline. And that’s it.
I have had to learn to trust myself. I urge you and your readers to do the same.
All of us are co-creators with the Universe. Trust yourself, and trust the process. You will write, and you will write well.
It's interesting, because I've found I have less access to community now than I did, say, two years ago. I live in Australia so have limited access to large writing events, and in-person writing groups never worked out for me (e.g. SCWBI meetings were always awkward because it was always retired women looking to write picture books and then... me, writing older YA and not even in my 20s. Uni classes and clubs also never worked out because of skill differential; I'd been writing novels since I was 15 and they were struggling to finish short stories), but I developed a network on Twitter where I made some great friends and could relatively easily find new beta readers/critique partners, and also was a member of a large regional NaNoWriMo Discord server where I happened to meet someone who is now one of my greatest friends.
However, when dear Elon took over Twitter and did whatever he did to the algorithm, I found my writing community suddenly vanished and whatever interactions I did have were overall negative - I've been ghosted and forced to block more people in the past year over beta reads than ever before. (I've also noticed that, as a person who's written 6 books now, the crowd I tend to find online are less experienced - maybe on book 1 or 2 - and can't give me the feedback I need to really push myself on a craft level.) And haven't been able to find a platform to replace it. The aforementioned Discord server also imploded the same year, and I've never been able to find the comradery I did there in a larger server again (I've joined some dedicated to pitch parties and things like Pitch Wars but been immediately overwhelmed by all of them). However, I am part of a very small server - which is fabulous, because I love everyone there, but also makes it difficult to find enough beta readers and critique partners because there are so few of us and not everyone can spare the time to read others' work. I have my trusted few people, but I don't know how I'm going to make beta reads for my next book work. It's a desperate thing, honestly: I want to connect with people who have a similar experience level as me so they can push me, who are professional, who won't take 4+ months to read 100k words or ghost me or send me nasty messages about my critiques. I daydream about being agented just so I can access agent siblings. But in the meantime, I'm lost about where to turn. I have my eye on QTCritique. But I don't have much hope that it'll actually work. We'll see.
I joined an IRL genre writing group in my area and that has worked well for general support relationships. I've had a harder time finding quality beta readers or friendly dev editor types (informal), the main qualification I've discovered is that I/we must respect the others' work and subgenre and read in in so we know what works and what doesn't. Finding reader friends with that quality seems to be a bit more a case of serendipity. I'm pretty audacious, so if I read something that I admire, I reach out to the author in a friendly way, not asking for anything, to see if we have enough in common to form a writing-centered friendship. I have found a few excellent writing friends that way, and sometimes I only hear once for someone, which is fine. My worst experiences have taught me a lot. They taught me it's a complete waste of time to beta read for someone whose subgenre you don't "get" and vice versa.
There was a writer’s group at the College where I teach. It was part of the Atlanta Writers Group. I joined the year before Covid. After COVID I formed the science fiction group. It is very casual get together. We read our stories out loud and get feedback. Our meetings are online. We tried hard core beta reading but everyone had families and jobs. Our group is like free therapy for sci-fi writers. We have fun.
I have found community by attending writer's festivals and conferences and getting out into the world where people are talking books and writing. The genesis of my now 7-year local critique group began when we all attended a book discussion event at a local library and discovered we were all writers.
The struggle is real. It was really hard to find a writing community as an agent and really. REALLY hard to find beta readers. I rep kid lit and had gone to the Highlights Foundation retreat center in my role as an agent. Over the course of a number of times there (eventually because I was retreating to write myself) I ended up finding some of my people. Mostly writers who were already agented or who wrote things I don't rep. I've also found community with some of my agency mates at the agency where I used to be repped. When I was on Twitter I kept my agent hat on, mostly. On Instagram I mostly keep my author hat on. Here? I dunno yet. Just poking my nose in now...
I connected with the other founding members of my critique group in a creative writing class via the UCLA Extension program in 2019. Members have come and gone, but we've maintained a core group of ~4 people the entire time, with each of us inviting additional writers we befriend along the way. I generally take on the admin role of sending emails alerting members to our next meeting and a reminder to share submissions a week in advance, though another member has graciously offered to host our Zoom chats. We used to meet IRL pre-COVID, but found that meeting virtually is easier than trying to cram 4 laptops on a café table, and a few members have moved out of LA over the years. I also have a monthly chat/active text thread with two women I met via the Discord group of the now defunct First Draft podcast; the three of us signed up for the wonderful Revision Season workshop hosted by author Elana K. Arnold, and the experience bonded us for life! I also made another great writer friend via a virtual writing retreat hosted by The Shit No One Tells You About Writing podcast. We live on opposite coasts, but have critiqued each others work, text/share IG content regularly, and have met up IRL twice!
I'm 62 so yes, an Old. My only writing community was IRL, back in my hometown of OKC. I didn't feel much of a bond because it seemed most of the group were writing trade fiction like romances. I thought of myself as an artist because my stories and poetry had been published in college literary journals and then had started writing screenplays about that time. I went to the annual conference one year and got to meet Tom Sawyer, of Murder She Wrote fame, and he was a real gem. A few of us went out to dinner with him at one of those horrible chain restaurants like Chili's when we should have shown him one of our local treasures! What surprised me most about that whole experience was that we kept in touch, he gave me some ideas, and when I was in L.A. for a legal conference, he offered to come down from Malibu to meet up.
I think I would benefit from a group now. Not a fan of Zoom so I guess I should look around for in-person groups here in southern New Mexico. I'm sure there's plenty up in Santa Fe, where I worked right before retirement.
During Covid I was working to complete my historical bio-fiction and one day, as I emerged from a research rabbit hole, I stumbled upon the Women’s Fiction Writers Association. Among the many great programs they offered was a schedule of Writing Dates that any member could join. Obviously, we met via Zoom and the brains behind the experiment, Michelle Montgomery, was so warm and welcoming. As the months progressed we all kept showing up. Not only did we finish current projects and developed new ones, we asked for and gave advice. We found beta readers, we got/gave help with each others’ queries, we celebrated our successes and supported each other in our disappointments. Four years later this group of writers is still thriving, and many of the original group have published at least one novel or memoir. Not everyone comes to every session, and indeed there are periods when we don’t see people for a while. But we always know that even if we can’t attend because life got in the way, when we’re ready and able we always have a home to go to.
WFWA also offers critique groups, mentors, fabulous workshops on craft many free to members and some that cost a nominal fee. This past September we had our 10th anniversary conference in Chicago where a number of the “Write-Inmates” met in person for the first time and it was the best “family reunion” many of us had ever attended.
Yes- for sure I feel a little like getting picked last for dodgeball. But, part of that might be my content & my resistance to ‘clicks’, I try to be honest and direct which can come across as harsh. I won’t rave about a book I didn’t connect with for the sake of community and I’m pretty sure that’s not a popular stance. I want this same honest raw feedback for my own work, and maybe I need to try a gentler approach? Maybe?
I have found community in many places: The California Writers Club (https://calwriters.org), first the SF Peninsula Branch and now Redwood Writers in the North Bay; two critique groups (found through CWC); Sonoma County Writers Camp, which I attended a couple of times (https://sonomacountywriterscamp.com); and most recently through the online writing community I founded with a dear friend of mine, Birth Your Truest Story (https://birth-your-truest-story.mn.co). Many writers who are part of the Birth Your Truest Story community have remarked about how much we offer to community members. I always answer that whatever I give I get back tenfold. It is so immensely gratifying to offer a space where we can connect, share, and support one another.
Oh... and I had to come back and edit this because I forgot to add Shut Up & Write (https://shutupwrite.com), which I've been involved with both as an attendee and host for many years, both in person and online; and Creative Caffeine (https://creativecaffeinedaily.com), which I participated in only briefly but which was a great experience.
Oh, and I suppose I now should add Substacks like this to my list!
From this thread I can see that there are so many ways to be part of a writing community! For me, I joined a local writing group in Orange County (O.C. Writers). They have a Facebook group, plus they host weekly in-person write-ins that include a discussion hour. I’ve learned so much by being a part of it. They are a fun, friendly, and encouraging group—I’m grateful for our weekly write-ins and shop talk. Also, I consider Substack to be another writing community that I belong to. I've met many friendly writers here, both in Notes and in comments sections. I'm not quite ready for beta readers yet (I'm about 80% through my second draft), but once I am, I'll probably look to O.C. Writer's, Substack, or Bianca Marais' match up.
Thanks for this amazing discussion! I'm bookmarking it so I can come back for more ideas. I'm a work-from-home, write-by-night person, so I'm sometimes starved for writing community. I've tried to be more intentional about creating it the last few years. Here's what I've done / realized:
1) I was working on a project in fall 2018, and I caught some notices about November as National Novel Writing Month (for the uninitiated: "NaNoWriMo" is when writers attempt to crank out a first draft of 50K words in a single month.) Even though I didn't have a shot at finishing my story that month, I wanted to meet like-minded writers, so I attended some NaNoWriMo "write-ins" at coffee shops and libraries near me. At literally THE FIRST ONE, there were only three of us... but we hit it off so well that we formed a writing group that's still going five years later. Props to our fearless leader, who does the labor of organizing this! It's no small thing.
2) Every few years I attend AWP, and while the conference can be pretty overwhelming, some of the subgroups are less so. At the Queer Caucus, I met two people who have become writing buddies and friends. We call ourselves the "Cherry Pies." We're from all over the country so we swap calls and manuscripts every few months.
3) Unless I'm unbelievably slammed, I say YES when someone asks for feedback on their work. (Usually a friend or a friend of a friend). It's a helpful way to sharpen my editing muscles, and the hope is that they'll reciprocate down the road.
4) As some others have mentioned, I participate in Bianca Marais' "Beta Reader Matchups," in which she pairs you with other writers in your same category/age for digital critique sessions. These can sometimes blossom into writing groups, and I've become the de facto organizer of one of these. I don't mind the logistical work because let's be real, I'm a planner not a pantser (!), and so far it hasn't been too time consuming. I appreciate how dedicated the writers in these groups are. FYI, Bianca also hosts of THE SHIT NO ONE TELLS YOU ABOUT WRITING podcast, which has its own Substack. Another good writing community worth joining!
5). I loooove when I find a writing partner or group member who matches my effort. It's a bummer when a get my WIP back from an early reader and it doesn't have many notes (good or bad or clarifying or whatever). I'm a "more feedback is better" type person -- IMO, it's nice to have things to chew on. My goal is to find writing friends who share that view.
6) Okay, one silly gripe to air! I kinda roll my eyes at the term "beta reader." (Even though I use it all the time, and I AM one.) It makes it sound like we're coders working on our killer apps, and if we can just work out the bugs, our products will be fit for market. Writing is so much squishier than this term makes it sound! I wish I had a good substitute ("Early reader?" "Feedbacker." I dunno!). This could just be a personal hang-up, I admit. :)
My strongest community comes from my fandom, but finding a pro writer's community has been a lot more challenging. I've met a lot of wonderful individuals, but the actual community aspect seems a bit more like me trying to fit in with a Brooklyn mom's group I met on a listserve: hearts are all in the right place, but there's a lot of mutual incomprehension and God forbid anyone brings up plastic bottles or disposable diapers.
I've realized I have to rein in my expectations: betaing or reviewing someone's work doesn't mean they'll offer to do the same, or even like your cover on Twitter. And just because you like meeting people with different perspectives doesn't mean they like meeting you. Or care. Why should they?
There are aspects of a writer's community that are competitive, aspects where you start to feel like you're in a virtual room full of people who are all just as full of ego and imposter syndrome and self-doubt as you are. That doesn't make an emotionally healthy space. It's no one's fault, but writing is desperate and solitary and HARD, and when you come up for air it can be even harder to get a community back.
How’d you find it? Google search for "women's fiction"
How long did it take for you to feel comfortable in it? As a member of the Women's Fiction Writers Association, I get to attend Writing Dates. These online writing sessions started four years ago, on the heels of covid. Immediately, I felt welcomed by the warm moderator, Michele Montgomery.
Are you a beta reader? Yes.
How does that work for you? Whenever a Write Inmate puts a call out for beta readers, I say yes.
Is it hard to keep your community organized? WFWA has about 3k members and about 50 Write Inmates. The organization is run by volunteers and the Zoom write-ins are hosted by various members. There's an evergreen link and sessions are available multiple times a day.
Does one person do all the work? (Are you that person lol?) no.
Have you struck out looking for community? Locally, it's hard. I live in Colorado Springs and know three writers.
What has surprised you most about finding or not finding community? Finding an online community means I have support, a group of writers to ask for advice, people to read my stuff. I have writing friends all over the world. I'm hoping they'll help me when I visit their city on my debut book tour!
Are you in any IRL writing communities? no. I started a weekly writing workshop at my library but it fizzled out.
Does it feel like getting picked last for dodgeball all over again? Sometimes.
Did you join something established or did you have to build it yourself. both
I've been in the same writing group for about 3 years now. We meet on Sundays for an hour virtually. It started because one of the group members put out a call to create one on Twitter. Several people responded, maybe 7-8, but within weeks it become that same 3 people. We are all novelists and short story writers. We share stories and novel excerpts, but we haven't shared full novel manuscripts. It's going really well. There was a period last year when several of us missed several weeks so we had to have a conversation about whether we wanted to continue. We all did. There were just some scheduling issues, but it was good to become rededicated to the endeavor. That discussion also allowed us to share in what ways we wanted to modify what we were doing. Instead of just writing for that period, we also said we wanted to also be able to just talk about the business of publishing or just gripe about how tough it can be at times. That injected a bit of fresh air into the sessions that we needed. I'm grateful for the group.
I have met other writers through a professional organization (WFWA) and while attending a conference. I put myself out there, did tons of page exchanges, joined two formal critique groups through WFWAs matching program, requested a mentor and then later offered to be a mentor, joined committees, talked with people at conferences, offered to beta read for them, made IG connections, and more.
From all that, I have about four writer friends that I chat with on a daily or weekly basis and would feel 100% okay contacting if something urgent came up. About 8 more I work with on a specific project and know if I ask them to read they’ll give insightful, genre appropriate feedback. And way more than that in general connections.
I’ve also worked with a lot of people whom I would not work with again! I’ve been polite and done my best and moved on. I’ve also hung around a lot of people who were friendly but had their own stuff and didn’t include me. Again… moving on.
So basically, there was no easy answer or group that magically formed around me. But I do believe, if you do your best for other people and keep showing up, that’s how to find genuine connections.
I'm so happy to hear you ask this question. Community makes a huge difference for writers. A supportive and knowledgeable community answers the easy questions, counsels through the difficult ones, and provides the support and cheers over rejections and wins. I have found this and more through the Women's Fiction Writers Association, WFWA. www.womensfictionwriters.org. I'm a former VP of Communications for this amazing international organization, the Founder of Women's Fiction Day, and currently I'm the Executive Editor of the Association magazine, WriteOn! I may be a little biased : ). I'm also a debut author with my novel coming out June 11 this year. I wouldn't have found an agent or published without WFWA. We are an online community that provides weekly community write-in sessions, monthly webinars, workshops, twice yearly retreats, an active Facebook Community and are now expanding the Mighty Networks platform, contests for unpublished and published authors, and so, so much more. We also put out a weekly news bulletin and a quarterly magazine. I've been with WFWA for almost 8 years and found them when I became serious about my writing but was alone and clueless about well...everything related to writing a novel and tender and green about the how to put the work into the world. WFWA offered me critique groups, mentor matching, query assistance, agent access and a community of writers who were writing in my genre. I stumbled on Women's Fiction when I was trying to determine what the heck was I writing, because it wasn't romance. I found my people, my guides, and have developed deep friendships with writers everywhere. It has been incredible to meet people through an online platform and then connect with them at retreats. Though WFWA I have also found members in my backyard and it's so easy to reach out to them with this common bond. When you meet another writer who shares your obsession and goals there is instant community. WFWA welcomes writers at all stages those starting their journey, debuts like myself, and celebrates big authors such as Camille Pagan, Heather Webb, Denny S. Bryce, Barbara O'neal, and Sarah Penner as members to name a few. The ability to connect is everything. Thanks for reading this long response. I'm also a subscriber and recommend Agents and Writers through my own Substack. I'm looking forward to your book and perhaps you'll consider becoming one of our webinar speakers in the future. Kind regards, Sharon Ritchey (writing as Sharon Wishnow)
I’m writing novels about a 13th century niece & uncle (Alice & Anselm) who solve crimes. Alice is 13 as is my coauthor, my granddaughter Miranda - the first book she coauthored (nonfiction) was published last year. We have two writing mentors - Sophie Hannah & Emma Darwin who have been very helpful. Sophie’s Dream Author course is great & provides something of a community, I’ve been to some of Emma’s Blue Pencil courses & she now has an excellent Substack.
I’ve always had writers baked into my larger ecosystem as an editor, so I understand the layers of being “writer adjacent” versus having an intimate network of writers.
I didn’t set out for it to happen this way, but my community of writers really grew out of an interview series I started last year called Cave of the Heart. Through the process of interviewing writers and creatives—and then editing and collaborating on their answers—I’ve found a handful of kindred spirits that feed my writing life in a much different way.
In a bigger way, my newsletter as a whole is also a gathering space for me to weave in and out of topics in a way that feels socially sustainable. From there I leap frog through a bunch of different newsletters that overlap with my interests in life (and therefore writing). A lot of my favorite folks I now follow because I found them in the comments section.
on a whim I signed up for a buddhist meditation and creative writing retreat in Austin, TX led by Susan Piver https://openheartproject.com/about/. I met a fantastic group of folks. we've been meeting regularly online for almost a year. it's been incredibly supportive. I haven't reached the stage of looking for beta readers yet, so I'm enjoying the responses from everyone on that topic.
I found a small local writers group through a local artist I was working with, and she only knew of it because the organizer had spoken with her when she was trying to set up a weekly meeting place. That was in 2019, and we moved to online meetings during lock down. There are eight of us, but only about 4 or 5 come to IRL meetings on the regular, we also have a private Facebook page. There are 2 who are more focused on the organizing and admin aspects of meetings, everyone is pretty loosey goosey with their time and commitments, but everyone has work, family, etc. It took me some time to feel comfortable sharing my work, but mostly it's been great. Not everyone knows how to give positive or constructive feedback, not even writers, so that is something I think should be discussed with someone before they join the group. I've learned who to share or not share with, I want valid criticism of my work, but I won't let it go beyond that (like one member who tried to make every damn thing political). Lately with this group, it's getting harder and harder to meet up, and I sense it's coming to an end. I am on the look out for a new group or may start one of my own with just a few people who are trustworthy and serious about their writing.
I belong to a few different writing communities. In 2018, I started my freelance writing business and looked for a local writing group to join. I found one via Meetup, but they met at 7am (!) and were focused on fiction, so I asked the leader if I could, using her Meetup, start a non-fiction sub-group. She agreed and I did that for a while.
Then she stopped her fiction group, and I didn't want to pay for Meetup, so my group migrated to a Facebook group, and also morphed into an any-genre writing group — because I'd started writing poetry and fiction by this point, and also I didn't need to worry about stepping on the toes of the fiction group.
(As a freelance writer, I've met a lot of other freelance writers in online courses and at in-person 'networking' [I hate that term] events.)
My any-genre writing group meets in-person at our local public library a couple of times a month, and there's also some interaction in the Facebook group. The FB group has 70+ members, but anywhere between 4-12 people come to the in-person meetings. There are some regulars, but it's not the same people every time.
In addition, I host an online group (via Zoom) for novelists who belong to the Federation of BC Writers. There are 8 of us and it's the same people every time. Zoom is socially more difficult for me than in-person, but I manage ok.
I don't find it hard to manage the organizational side of things. I do it all myself, yes.
I also have a bunch of alpha/beta readers, most of whom I met on Facebook or, to a lesser extent, Instagram. I've had mostly wonderful experiences with the people who have alpha or beta read for me. A key is to offer a small sample (say the first three chapters), before asking people to commit. It's hard to commit to reading a whole book, if you don't know what it's like. (In my own experience as a beta reader for others, I've been burned by committing to a whole book without reading a sample first — so heed my warning! 😂)
Six of us were in a “Zoom” writing class offered by University of Chicago. When it broke for summer, one of us reached out to writers she admired and who had been thoughtful and generous with comments and feedback. We all write fiction — Biblical, time travel, a marriage story, etc. We meet weekly for one hour, over Zoom, and discuss one writer’s work. Typically, about 20 pages. I and another typically moderate conversation. No one talks too much. We send written comments separately. It works. I like it more than U of C class where we met; I had to read and give feedback to four writers weekly. I had too many stories in my head.
I signed up for some online writing courses during Covid and miraculously, organically, out of that virtual space, found two great writing companions, which then developed into a writing group. We've been meeting more or less montly for more than 2 years. It's amazing. The people in the group are better writers than I am, and have published fiction (I've only published academic books thus far), and that's great: it's like learning to play tennis, right? It helps to play with someone who can hit the ball back & whose skills are aspirational but achievable (ie: I don't want to play tennis with Serena Williams b/c obviously). But I also have been in groups that have been disastrous, in that there were wildly different expectations & energies, so it felt like a chore rather than an opportunity. It seems, though, like aspiring writers are starved for community, given the number of (frequently expensive) workshops, online courses, retreats, and etc. And those purveyors of community aren't always necessarily on the up-and-up... But having a sense of belonging really, really helps.
For a while, I had a super hard time finding an online writing group that had people who were actually writing. Loads of them exist where people talk about writing or talk about their book idea endlessly without ever actually writing. Luckily, I stumbled into a discord by pure chance after I attended a writing seminar from a well known author. After the talk, she was kind enough to link everyone to a message board she'd set up. The message board was for writers to share ideas, maybe find crit partners, etc, but off of it, someone posted a link to a writing discord and that was it. Somehow that was the perfect group. Everyone in it was super motivated, super committed to the craft, into learning, and writing so much! Now we're all very close ride or die kind of friends. We've had in-person retreats twice now (a third planned for this year), crit one another's works, have book clubs, and all around support each other in getting drafts done, getting agents, being on submissions, working through plot stuff. Any and everything. I feel fantastically lucky to have found this group.
I found my beta reader/ writer group through Bianca Marais, https://www.biancamarais.com/beta-reader-match-up.html there are 6 of us writing the same genre. We formed a Discord server and we chat, share the terrors and glories of querying and swap chapters and full manuscript reads. They are the best. I have also found a beta reader through an online class, she is writing in my niche so we connected up via email.
I'm in the same boat! I've done a couple of Bianca's groups, and they've been helpful to find kindred spirits in my same genre / target age category. Another benefit: participants generally have a goal of finishing and revising (and often publishing or self-publishing) a work, so we can commiserate about the total process.
Thank you for sharing that - looks like a good resource!
Emma, glad you found beta readers. I remember you were kind enough to share info on submissions and rejections.
The best writing community I've found (for fiction and nonfiction) is George Saunders' Substack Story Club. I've never been in a writing community where 1) the "instructor" (for lack of a better word) is so clear and insightful and open-minded, and can actually lead you through the writing process, 2) ALL the comments are additionally so helpful and validating (and there are so many of them!), and 3) all the advice can ACTUALLY CHANGE YOUR WRITING. The whole group is so kind and empathetic. It's remarkable. I recommend it all the time.
I will now tell you a short story about building community, but this one isn't about a writers group. It's about a diagnosis. On March 4th, I received a phone call from my dermatologist. I'd been in to her office the week before for a regular skin check, something I'd done every 5 years since I was a child. Born fair, freckled and spotted with moles, having grown up in sunny climates... I am a poster child for skin cancer awareness. Before this year, I never got a phone call. It was always a form letter stating the results of the biopsy and how they were non-cancerous. But this time, it was a phone call and the diagnosis was melanoma.
Even through the shock and fear, I knew I was going to need some help. I was going to need surgeries, rides to & from hospital, a comforting shoulder to turn to and someone to talk me off the cliff I kept finding myself tumbling down. I told myself it was OK to feel all the feelings. It was OK to take naps, and not think for a while. It was OK to mourn my old life and the body parts I might lose. It was OK to envision a new way of living, that involved less sun, more screen. But, I was going to have to find my people. I had to find melanoma specialists in my area, I was going to find the people who would give me support and put their own drama aside for a minute, I was going to have to ask for help and that was not something I was good at, asking for help - I was the person others went to for help. I learned that others may not know how to help and so it is imperative to be clear: I need a ride. I need someone to mow my lawn. I'd love some soup. I need a hug. I think this is true no matter the community that one is trying to form or fit in with; you need to be clear about your needs and objectives, you may have to articulate that to the people who show up because they might not know what you need.
I’ve always been an avid reader, and writing is a late-in-life passion project for me after years of being an accountant. I started from scratch, having an interesting idea for a novel, but not really knowing how to write creatively. I’m lucky to live in Seattle where the writing community thrives. Many independent bookstores hold author events that are free to the public, and it’s one of the best ways to show support. As a bonus, I began bumping into the same people, many of whom are writers themselves. I also attend writer conferences and continuing education classes, finding serious writers who are interested in honing their craft and sharing what they’ve learned. It can be a slow process, because established writer groups are hesitant to add members, but new groups are forming every day, and it’s pretty simple to start one of your own, especially if you’re willing to host. These connections lead to beta readers, but there’s an unwritten agreement you’ll become one as well, which takes time. I’ve learned much about my own writing by beta reading other’s work. And, most recently, I’ve beta read for established authors, which is like taking a masters class. Currently, I’m a member of two writing groups. Each meets in person once a month, and one is for critique and the other for timed writing. I also belong to a group on FB that’s for accountability and meets every Sunday morning. All of this took way longer than I originally thought it would, but, oh my gosh, I feel more fulfilled than I ever thought possible!!! ♥️
Thank you everyone for all your comments, stories, leads, and ideas!!!!
I first found a writing community in my MFA program, Solstice MFA in Creative Writing Program, now at Laselle University (https://www.lasell.edu/graduate-studies/academics/mfa-in-creative-writing.html). I know that's not everyone's experience, but the director of that program, Meg Kearney, built the program with community as a guiding principle (Here's a piece I wrote in my Accidental Mentors series about Meg's philosophy: https://www.annettemarquis.com/p/learning-to-write-is-a-collective). It made all the difference for me. In fact, I continue to be involved in the community, more than ten years later. I'm going back for a week long retreat during their summer residency this July. I can't wait. After I graduated, I went to work for a local writers organization, James River Writers (https://jamesriverwriters.org/). It, too, sees community as its major mission: "James River Writers (JRW) builds community by connecting, supporting, and inspiring writers and lovers of the written word in central Virginia and beyond." Both experiences have taught me that I need to be in a community of other writers. It makes me a better writer, more engaged with my craft, and encouraged and motivated to keep writing. I couldn't write without them.
The Muse, my favorite local writer's center, has a ton of resources and links to other communities (https://the-muse.org/writers-resource/). I found that center in grad school and taught there later, and they are open and thoughtful people who continue to grow the community both onsite and online. There are some people who are more impressed with themselves than those around them, but they're thankfully few and far between. For the most part, everyone loves writing as art and it's wonderful to be in that vibe. My grad school cohort is the other core of my writing community even if we're not constantly in touch, it's nice to know there's help for each other when we need it.
Meant to add Writing Excuses (https://writingexcuses.com)! They are how I found this substack and have added newer community building elements. :)
Good to know, thanks
So interesting to see all the different examples. I joined a paid (~$150/month) online writing workshop in 2021 that's specific to the romance genre. I was skeptical that it would be worth the money, but I've found it not only to be a helpful community to workshop pieces in, but also to find community with writers in a similar stage as me (debut romance writers who have not yet published and largely haven't yet queried). I do think there's been a lot of value in working with writers within my genre, given the common tropes, unique structure and expectations readers have in romance. I think if (once?!) I get representation, I might leave the group but I could see myself trying to spin out a writing group with a few writers at a similar stage to me to remain connected. Writing is so solitary, that just having folks to debrief the psychology of writing and the blockers involved has been really valuable to me.
I was so inspired by reading Natalie Goldberg's Writing Down the Bones in college that shortly after graduation, I stuck a note on the local hippie bookstore's cork board calling for writers to join me for a group like the one she describes in the book. A few people answered the call (and subsequent classified ads-- so old school!) to free write at a coffee shop for two hours every week and read aloud without judgment or apology. We have paused a few times (when I went out of state for my MFA, when I joined the Peace Corps) but the core group is still going strong. We shifted to Zoom during COVID and pulled in a few out of state members, including one who first joined us as a high school student nearly 30 years ago. It's magic!
I’m actually in the trenches of this now. I have a BA in creative writing but took a different path than my classmates and lost touch. Years later, I’ve found my way back to writing fiction and am building my new community from scratch. I found my first few writer friends via Substack (yay!) and after some trial and error with groups, I applied for (and got into) a year-long course/workshop that starts next week. It’s not cheap, and I expect it to be pretty intensive (which is what I want.) The group has an email chain going already where we are introducing ourselves and our projects, and it feels like maybe I’ve found my people. (I hope they like me lol)
As to Beta readers, I always recommend that writers use them before paying a content or structure editor (my day job). I maintain that Beta readers can point out plot holes and character issues which will make the ms atronger by the time I read it. So everyone wins.
Sound advice
Almost twenty years ago, when I was still working for a publisher, a work friend and I had lunch, and both of us expressed interest in joining a writing group. I said "we should just start one" and so we did.
We've lost and gained a couple of writers but we're still going strong. The members came to my book launch in January--joining other friends and family, of course--and what a full circle moment that was.
I'm in two other writing communities, both spawned by conferences. I find a great deal of support, even when it's all virtual...but especially when we all reunite, once a year or more.
My writing community centres around the Poetry Society Derby Stanza group and an International poetry group (both of which I run). I also have a broad range of connections thanks to my anthology publication work with Coverstory books. Hoping comes of Substack, but there are lots of voices here! Seeking a new in-person group where we are now living (Market Rasen, UK), and may just have to set one up myself!
Once I got back into freelance work, I developed connections in the news business. When I tried finding community in creative writing in my area I found myself locked out by the local queen bee. I didn't kiss up enough to her, and she was a gatekeeper. But I started out by offering manuscript swaps anyway. Then I enrolled in an MFA, and we now have a wonderful alumni network to read, edit, and hype each others' work. And it all took a long time--24 years or so.
Those queen bees can be a pain. Just had a run in with one this weekend. Tempted to escalate—there’s the danger of writing fiction, always looking for drama—buuuut, stood down. Glad you ditched her and found a better group.
She actually moved away to greener pastures, as I understand it. Good for her I say.
The upside of having booked the entire summer at a lake, is time alone to write. The downside of having booked the entire summer at a lake, is time alone to write. I sure miss my writing friends, the walks we take to shore each other up, to encourage each other to keep going, and reassure each other that rejection means you're a real writer. Tonight, as I dine alone, I'll toast the writing communities that keep us going when it all seems just so hard.
I have participated in a few writing groups, usually without success. Either one or two people dominate the discussion, or they are condescending to those who write in different genres from them. But I believe writing communities are important, so that a writer doesn’t feel so alone. I won’t give up. Like relationships, one will come along when it is right.
I had met Elizabeth Gaffney through A Public Space. Started her Novel workshop right as Covid hit. She turned the workshop online. From that she created The 24hourroom.org. An online community with slow readings, craft conversation. I found a vibrant writing community. Great writers. Great people.
I’ve found some community in groups like WFWA and in online classes I’ve taken. My history in writing was based in journalism so when I decided to go into fiction, I had to find new community. I’m still looking for good beta readers who’d like to trade work.
I am late to the discussion, but I’m curious if others have had similar experiences with writing communities online. It seems like when you are engaged on the platform at least daily, your community is alive and well. But if you take some time away, it feels like FOMO and those connections shrivel. People “move on” without you. The social algorithms don’t help with this, of course, and unfortunately (or fortunately?) my mental health is best when I’m not plugged into socials all the time. I’ve found the most “sticking” community through my local SCBWI chapter and an online novel intensive course - places where I have met people on video or in person. Not sure if the “face to face” makes the connection/community stronger, but that seems to be the trend for me. Probably all comes down to personal preference!
I feel like my writing community is actually a bunch of communities: online, IRL, and in-between (texting threads mixed with Zoom). It's a patchwork quilt that keeps me warm, made up of scraps from my journey--a critique group that started from another; and so on. There is no organizing them. There is only me, flitting between them, and enjoying what is unique about each--knowing what I go to that one place for and honoring that, and doing the same for each.
CLUBHOUSE! I signed up in 2020 and from listening and speaking with the Indie authors I realised it is possible to make a living from writing books. I am now a full-time author as a result. The Author Conference is at 2pm CET every week day (it is mostly writers in the US having their morning coffee!) It's where 6-7 figure authors and start up writers get together and discuss topics about publishing, marketing, etc. There is a room that follows it Writers Tribe Morning Chat. There are daily writing sprint rooms, weekly online meetups for; social media for authors, crime authors, cozy mystery, historical fiction. Anyone can join in the discussions. Best to join and just listen for the first few times and don't feel overwhelmed you'll soon get to know everyone and feel part of the group. :)
Weirdly, one of my best communities was someone who made a Google doc and said they were putting together writing groups on Twitter. We’ve been meeting every two weeks for two years and it’s been awesome. One of us even became an agent in that time. They actually rep one of us now. I got my agent in 2023, and the others are just trying to keep writing going in their lives but it’s been a really great group. I also have one in-person, but they are mostly poets. Great company though.
In case you haven't heard, Blackbird Writers is an awesome community of 24 authors (there's only room for 4 and 20!) all flying under the Mystery umbrella. We are Cozy, Comic Cozy, Romantic suspense, Thriller, Police Procedural and more. We all support each other's news and events and have a weekly blog. Feel free to check us out here on Substack, or visit www.blackbirdwriters.com. Thanks!
https://blackbirdwriters.substack.com/
I started a group with several friends that I learned were secretly also working on their writing and feeling like it wasn’t going anywhere, like me! We’ve only had 3 meetings so far but they’ve been extremely encouraging and healing ❤️ the hardest part is of course scheduling — we’ve been doing weekends for work schedules but that means a lot of the days get canceled in the summer months as people are on trips etc, still gotta figure that out!
Thank you, Kate, for your thoughts, and for cheering us on.
I finally had to give up on trying to find a group of writers. I do write, profusely, every day, and I publish every week on Substack. If the comments are any indication, I am going the right way.
I am a veteran, anyway, having spent my entire career in a newsroom, editing, and writing. One thing you learn there is that you have to write on deadline. And that’s it.
I have had to learn to trust myself. I urge you and your readers to do the same.
All of us are co-creators with the Universe. Trust yourself, and trust the process. You will write, and you will write well.
It's interesting, because I've found I have less access to community now than I did, say, two years ago. I live in Australia so have limited access to large writing events, and in-person writing groups never worked out for me (e.g. SCWBI meetings were always awkward because it was always retired women looking to write picture books and then... me, writing older YA and not even in my 20s. Uni classes and clubs also never worked out because of skill differential; I'd been writing novels since I was 15 and they were struggling to finish short stories), but I developed a network on Twitter where I made some great friends and could relatively easily find new beta readers/critique partners, and also was a member of a large regional NaNoWriMo Discord server where I happened to meet someone who is now one of my greatest friends.
However, when dear Elon took over Twitter and did whatever he did to the algorithm, I found my writing community suddenly vanished and whatever interactions I did have were overall negative - I've been ghosted and forced to block more people in the past year over beta reads than ever before. (I've also noticed that, as a person who's written 6 books now, the crowd I tend to find online are less experienced - maybe on book 1 or 2 - and can't give me the feedback I need to really push myself on a craft level.) And haven't been able to find a platform to replace it. The aforementioned Discord server also imploded the same year, and I've never been able to find the comradery I did there in a larger server again (I've joined some dedicated to pitch parties and things like Pitch Wars but been immediately overwhelmed by all of them). However, I am part of a very small server - which is fabulous, because I love everyone there, but also makes it difficult to find enough beta readers and critique partners because there are so few of us and not everyone can spare the time to read others' work. I have my trusted few people, but I don't know how I'm going to make beta reads for my next book work. It's a desperate thing, honestly: I want to connect with people who have a similar experience level as me so they can push me, who are professional, who won't take 4+ months to read 100k words or ghost me or send me nasty messages about my critiques. I daydream about being agented just so I can access agent siblings. But in the meantime, I'm lost about where to turn. I have my eye on QTCritique. But I don't have much hope that it'll actually work. We'll see.
I joined an IRL genre writing group in my area and that has worked well for general support relationships. I've had a harder time finding quality beta readers or friendly dev editor types (informal), the main qualification I've discovered is that I/we must respect the others' work and subgenre and read in in so we know what works and what doesn't. Finding reader friends with that quality seems to be a bit more a case of serendipity. I'm pretty audacious, so if I read something that I admire, I reach out to the author in a friendly way, not asking for anything, to see if we have enough in common to form a writing-centered friendship. I have found a few excellent writing friends that way, and sometimes I only hear once for someone, which is fine. My worst experiences have taught me a lot. They taught me it's a complete waste of time to beta read for someone whose subgenre you don't "get" and vice versa.
There was a writer’s group at the College where I teach. It was part of the Atlanta Writers Group. I joined the year before Covid. After COVID I formed the science fiction group. It is very casual get together. We read our stories out loud and get feedback. Our meetings are online. We tried hard core beta reading but everyone had families and jobs. Our group is like free therapy for sci-fi writers. We have fun.
I have found community by attending writer's festivals and conferences and getting out into the world where people are talking books and writing. The genesis of my now 7-year local critique group began when we all attended a book discussion event at a local library and discovered we were all writers.
The struggle is real. It was really hard to find a writing community as an agent and really. REALLY hard to find beta readers. I rep kid lit and had gone to the Highlights Foundation retreat center in my role as an agent. Over the course of a number of times there (eventually because I was retreating to write myself) I ended up finding some of my people. Mostly writers who were already agented or who wrote things I don't rep. I've also found community with some of my agency mates at the agency where I used to be repped. When I was on Twitter I kept my agent hat on, mostly. On Instagram I mostly keep my author hat on. Here? I dunno yet. Just poking my nose in now...
I connected with the other founding members of my critique group in a creative writing class via the UCLA Extension program in 2019. Members have come and gone, but we've maintained a core group of ~4 people the entire time, with each of us inviting additional writers we befriend along the way. I generally take on the admin role of sending emails alerting members to our next meeting and a reminder to share submissions a week in advance, though another member has graciously offered to host our Zoom chats. We used to meet IRL pre-COVID, but found that meeting virtually is easier than trying to cram 4 laptops on a café table, and a few members have moved out of LA over the years. I also have a monthly chat/active text thread with two women I met via the Discord group of the now defunct First Draft podcast; the three of us signed up for the wonderful Revision Season workshop hosted by author Elana K. Arnold, and the experience bonded us for life! I also made another great writer friend via a virtual writing retreat hosted by The Shit No One Tells You About Writing podcast. We live on opposite coasts, but have critiqued each others work, text/share IG content regularly, and have met up IRL twice!
I'm 62 so yes, an Old. My only writing community was IRL, back in my hometown of OKC. I didn't feel much of a bond because it seemed most of the group were writing trade fiction like romances. I thought of myself as an artist because my stories and poetry had been published in college literary journals and then had started writing screenplays about that time. I went to the annual conference one year and got to meet Tom Sawyer, of Murder She Wrote fame, and he was a real gem. A few of us went out to dinner with him at one of those horrible chain restaurants like Chili's when we should have shown him one of our local treasures! What surprised me most about that whole experience was that we kept in touch, he gave me some ideas, and when I was in L.A. for a legal conference, he offered to come down from Malibu to meet up.
I think I would benefit from a group now. Not a fan of Zoom so I guess I should look around for in-person groups here in southern New Mexico. I'm sure there's plenty up in Santa Fe, where I worked right before retirement.
During Covid I was working to complete my historical bio-fiction and one day, as I emerged from a research rabbit hole, I stumbled upon the Women’s Fiction Writers Association. Among the many great programs they offered was a schedule of Writing Dates that any member could join. Obviously, we met via Zoom and the brains behind the experiment, Michelle Montgomery, was so warm and welcoming. As the months progressed we all kept showing up. Not only did we finish current projects and developed new ones, we asked for and gave advice. We found beta readers, we got/gave help with each others’ queries, we celebrated our successes and supported each other in our disappointments. Four years later this group of writers is still thriving, and many of the original group have published at least one novel or memoir. Not everyone comes to every session, and indeed there are periods when we don’t see people for a while. But we always know that even if we can’t attend because life got in the way, when we’re ready and able we always have a home to go to.
WFWA also offers critique groups, mentors, fabulous workshops on craft many free to members and some that cost a nominal fee. This past September we had our 10th anniversary conference in Chicago where a number of the “Write-Inmates” met in person for the first time and it was the best “family reunion” many of us had ever attended.
Yes- for sure I feel a little like getting picked last for dodgeball. But, part of that might be my content & my resistance to ‘clicks’, I try to be honest and direct which can come across as harsh. I won’t rave about a book I didn’t connect with for the sake of community and I’m pretty sure that’s not a popular stance. I want this same honest raw feedback for my own work, and maybe I need to try a gentler approach? Maybe?
I have found community in many places: The California Writers Club (https://calwriters.org), first the SF Peninsula Branch and now Redwood Writers in the North Bay; two critique groups (found through CWC); Sonoma County Writers Camp, which I attended a couple of times (https://sonomacountywriterscamp.com); and most recently through the online writing community I founded with a dear friend of mine, Birth Your Truest Story (https://birth-your-truest-story.mn.co). Many writers who are part of the Birth Your Truest Story community have remarked about how much we offer to community members. I always answer that whatever I give I get back tenfold. It is so immensely gratifying to offer a space where we can connect, share, and support one another.
Oh... and I had to come back and edit this because I forgot to add Shut Up & Write (https://shutupwrite.com), which I've been involved with both as an attendee and host for many years, both in person and online; and Creative Caffeine (https://creativecaffeinedaily.com), which I participated in only briefly but which was a great experience.
Oh, and I suppose I now should add Substacks like this to my list!
From this thread I can see that there are so many ways to be part of a writing community! For me, I joined a local writing group in Orange County (O.C. Writers). They have a Facebook group, plus they host weekly in-person write-ins that include a discussion hour. I’ve learned so much by being a part of it. They are a fun, friendly, and encouraging group—I’m grateful for our weekly write-ins and shop talk. Also, I consider Substack to be another writing community that I belong to. I've met many friendly writers here, both in Notes and in comments sections. I'm not quite ready for beta readers yet (I'm about 80% through my second draft), but once I am, I'll probably look to O.C. Writer's, Substack, or Bianca Marais' match up.
Thanks for this amazing discussion! I'm bookmarking it so I can come back for more ideas. I'm a work-from-home, write-by-night person, so I'm sometimes starved for writing community. I've tried to be more intentional about creating it the last few years. Here's what I've done / realized:
1) I was working on a project in fall 2018, and I caught some notices about November as National Novel Writing Month (for the uninitiated: "NaNoWriMo" is when writers attempt to crank out a first draft of 50K words in a single month.) Even though I didn't have a shot at finishing my story that month, I wanted to meet like-minded writers, so I attended some NaNoWriMo "write-ins" at coffee shops and libraries near me. At literally THE FIRST ONE, there were only three of us... but we hit it off so well that we formed a writing group that's still going five years later. Props to our fearless leader, who does the labor of organizing this! It's no small thing.
2) Every few years I attend AWP, and while the conference can be pretty overwhelming, some of the subgroups are less so. At the Queer Caucus, I met two people who have become writing buddies and friends. We call ourselves the "Cherry Pies." We're from all over the country so we swap calls and manuscripts every few months.
3) Unless I'm unbelievably slammed, I say YES when someone asks for feedback on their work. (Usually a friend or a friend of a friend). It's a helpful way to sharpen my editing muscles, and the hope is that they'll reciprocate down the road.
4) As some others have mentioned, I participate in Bianca Marais' "Beta Reader Matchups," in which she pairs you with other writers in your same category/age for digital critique sessions. These can sometimes blossom into writing groups, and I've become the de facto organizer of one of these. I don't mind the logistical work because let's be real, I'm a planner not a pantser (!), and so far it hasn't been too time consuming. I appreciate how dedicated the writers in these groups are. FYI, Bianca also hosts of THE SHIT NO ONE TELLS YOU ABOUT WRITING podcast, which has its own Substack. Another good writing community worth joining!
5). I loooove when I find a writing partner or group member who matches my effort. It's a bummer when a get my WIP back from an early reader and it doesn't have many notes (good or bad or clarifying or whatever). I'm a "more feedback is better" type person -- IMO, it's nice to have things to chew on. My goal is to find writing friends who share that view.
6) Okay, one silly gripe to air! I kinda roll my eyes at the term "beta reader." (Even though I use it all the time, and I AM one.) It makes it sound like we're coders working on our killer apps, and if we can just work out the bugs, our products will be fit for market. Writing is so much squishier than this term makes it sound! I wish I had a good substitute ("Early reader?" "Feedbacker." I dunno!). This could just be a personal hang-up, I admit. :)
Okay long scroll over!
My strongest community comes from my fandom, but finding a pro writer's community has been a lot more challenging. I've met a lot of wonderful individuals, but the actual community aspect seems a bit more like me trying to fit in with a Brooklyn mom's group I met on a listserve: hearts are all in the right place, but there's a lot of mutual incomprehension and God forbid anyone brings up plastic bottles or disposable diapers.
I've realized I have to rein in my expectations: betaing or reviewing someone's work doesn't mean they'll offer to do the same, or even like your cover on Twitter. And just because you like meeting people with different perspectives doesn't mean they like meeting you. Or care. Why should they?
There are aspects of a writer's community that are competitive, aspects where you start to feel like you're in a virtual room full of people who are all just as full of ego and imposter syndrome and self-doubt as you are. That doesn't make an emotionally healthy space. It's no one's fault, but writing is desperate and solitary and HARD, and when you come up for air it can be even harder to get a community back.
So many questions!! I love questions!
Where is it? Online
How’d you find it? Google search for "women's fiction"
How long did it take for you to feel comfortable in it? As a member of the Women's Fiction Writers Association, I get to attend Writing Dates. These online writing sessions started four years ago, on the heels of covid. Immediately, I felt welcomed by the warm moderator, Michele Montgomery.
Are you a beta reader? Yes.
How does that work for you? Whenever a Write Inmate puts a call out for beta readers, I say yes.
Is it hard to keep your community organized? WFWA has about 3k members and about 50 Write Inmates. The organization is run by volunteers and the Zoom write-ins are hosted by various members. There's an evergreen link and sessions are available multiple times a day.
Does one person do all the work? (Are you that person lol?) no.
Have you struck out looking for community? Locally, it's hard. I live in Colorado Springs and know three writers.
What has surprised you most about finding or not finding community? Finding an online community means I have support, a group of writers to ask for advice, people to read my stuff. I have writing friends all over the world. I'm hoping they'll help me when I visit their city on my debut book tour!
Are you in any IRL writing communities? no. I started a weekly writing workshop at my library but it fizzled out.
Does it feel like getting picked last for dodgeball all over again? Sometimes.
Did you join something established or did you have to build it yourself. both
If you built it, did they come? in the beginning.
Hi Marta, I was wondering whether I could talk to you more about beta reading. Could I DM you please?
Melita
Sure!
I've been in the same writing group for about 3 years now. We meet on Sundays for an hour virtually. It started because one of the group members put out a call to create one on Twitter. Several people responded, maybe 7-8, but within weeks it become that same 3 people. We are all novelists and short story writers. We share stories and novel excerpts, but we haven't shared full novel manuscripts. It's going really well. There was a period last year when several of us missed several weeks so we had to have a conversation about whether we wanted to continue. We all did. There were just some scheduling issues, but it was good to become rededicated to the endeavor. That discussion also allowed us to share in what ways we wanted to modify what we were doing. Instead of just writing for that period, we also said we wanted to also be able to just talk about the business of publishing or just gripe about how tough it can be at times. That injected a bit of fresh air into the sessions that we needed. I'm grateful for the group.
I have met other writers through a professional organization (WFWA) and while attending a conference. I put myself out there, did tons of page exchanges, joined two formal critique groups through WFWAs matching program, requested a mentor and then later offered to be a mentor, joined committees, talked with people at conferences, offered to beta read for them, made IG connections, and more.
From all that, I have about four writer friends that I chat with on a daily or weekly basis and would feel 100% okay contacting if something urgent came up. About 8 more I work with on a specific project and know if I ask them to read they’ll give insightful, genre appropriate feedback. And way more than that in general connections.
I’ve also worked with a lot of people whom I would not work with again! I’ve been polite and done my best and moved on. I’ve also hung around a lot of people who were friendly but had their own stuff and didn’t include me. Again… moving on.
So basically, there was no easy answer or group that magically formed around me. But I do believe, if you do your best for other people and keep showing up, that’s how to find genuine connections.
HI, Kate,
I'm so happy to hear you ask this question. Community makes a huge difference for writers. A supportive and knowledgeable community answers the easy questions, counsels through the difficult ones, and provides the support and cheers over rejections and wins. I have found this and more through the Women's Fiction Writers Association, WFWA. www.womensfictionwriters.org. I'm a former VP of Communications for this amazing international organization, the Founder of Women's Fiction Day, and currently I'm the Executive Editor of the Association magazine, WriteOn! I may be a little biased : ). I'm also a debut author with my novel coming out June 11 this year. I wouldn't have found an agent or published without WFWA. We are an online community that provides weekly community write-in sessions, monthly webinars, workshops, twice yearly retreats, an active Facebook Community and are now expanding the Mighty Networks platform, contests for unpublished and published authors, and so, so much more. We also put out a weekly news bulletin and a quarterly magazine. I've been with WFWA for almost 8 years and found them when I became serious about my writing but was alone and clueless about well...everything related to writing a novel and tender and green about the how to put the work into the world. WFWA offered me critique groups, mentor matching, query assistance, agent access and a community of writers who were writing in my genre. I stumbled on Women's Fiction when I was trying to determine what the heck was I writing, because it wasn't romance. I found my people, my guides, and have developed deep friendships with writers everywhere. It has been incredible to meet people through an online platform and then connect with them at retreats. Though WFWA I have also found members in my backyard and it's so easy to reach out to them with this common bond. When you meet another writer who shares your obsession and goals there is instant community. WFWA welcomes writers at all stages those starting their journey, debuts like myself, and celebrates big authors such as Camille Pagan, Heather Webb, Denny S. Bryce, Barbara O'neal, and Sarah Penner as members to name a few. The ability to connect is everything. Thanks for reading this long response. I'm also a subscriber and recommend Agents and Writers through my own Substack. I'm looking forward to your book and perhaps you'll consider becoming one of our webinar speakers in the future. Kind regards, Sharon Ritchey (writing as Sharon Wishnow)
I’m writing novels about a 13th century niece & uncle (Alice & Anselm) who solve crimes. Alice is 13 as is my coauthor, my granddaughter Miranda - the first book she coauthored (nonfiction) was published last year. We have two writing mentors - Sophie Hannah & Emma Darwin who have been very helpful. Sophie’s Dream Author course is great & provides something of a community, I’ve been to some of Emma’s Blue Pencil courses & she now has an excellent Substack.
I’ve always had writers baked into my larger ecosystem as an editor, so I understand the layers of being “writer adjacent” versus having an intimate network of writers.
I didn’t set out for it to happen this way, but my community of writers really grew out of an interview series I started last year called Cave of the Heart. Through the process of interviewing writers and creatives—and then editing and collaborating on their answers—I’ve found a handful of kindred spirits that feed my writing life in a much different way.
In a bigger way, my newsletter as a whole is also a gathering space for me to weave in and out of topics in a way that feels socially sustainable. From there I leap frog through a bunch of different newsletters that overlap with my interests in life (and therefore writing). A lot of my favorite folks I now follow because I found them in the comments section.
on a whim I signed up for a buddhist meditation and creative writing retreat in Austin, TX led by Susan Piver https://openheartproject.com/about/. I met a fantastic group of folks. we've been meeting regularly online for almost a year. it's been incredibly supportive. I haven't reached the stage of looking for beta readers yet, so I'm enjoying the responses from everyone on that topic.
I found a small local writers group through a local artist I was working with, and she only knew of it because the organizer had spoken with her when she was trying to set up a weekly meeting place. That was in 2019, and we moved to online meetings during lock down. There are eight of us, but only about 4 or 5 come to IRL meetings on the regular, we also have a private Facebook page. There are 2 who are more focused on the organizing and admin aspects of meetings, everyone is pretty loosey goosey with their time and commitments, but everyone has work, family, etc. It took me some time to feel comfortable sharing my work, but mostly it's been great. Not everyone knows how to give positive or constructive feedback, not even writers, so that is something I think should be discussed with someone before they join the group. I've learned who to share or not share with, I want valid criticism of my work, but I won't let it go beyond that (like one member who tried to make every damn thing political). Lately with this group, it's getting harder and harder to meet up, and I sense it's coming to an end. I am on the look out for a new group or may start one of my own with just a few people who are trustworthy and serious about their writing.
I belong to a few different writing communities. In 2018, I started my freelance writing business and looked for a local writing group to join. I found one via Meetup, but they met at 7am (!) and were focused on fiction, so I asked the leader if I could, using her Meetup, start a non-fiction sub-group. She agreed and I did that for a while.
Then she stopped her fiction group, and I didn't want to pay for Meetup, so my group migrated to a Facebook group, and also morphed into an any-genre writing group — because I'd started writing poetry and fiction by this point, and also I didn't need to worry about stepping on the toes of the fiction group.
(As a freelance writer, I've met a lot of other freelance writers in online courses and at in-person 'networking' [I hate that term] events.)
My any-genre writing group meets in-person at our local public library a couple of times a month, and there's also some interaction in the Facebook group. The FB group has 70+ members, but anywhere between 4-12 people come to the in-person meetings. There are some regulars, but it's not the same people every time.
In addition, I host an online group (via Zoom) for novelists who belong to the Federation of BC Writers. There are 8 of us and it's the same people every time. Zoom is socially more difficult for me than in-person, but I manage ok.
I don't find it hard to manage the organizational side of things. I do it all myself, yes.
I also have a bunch of alpha/beta readers, most of whom I met on Facebook or, to a lesser extent, Instagram. I've had mostly wonderful experiences with the people who have alpha or beta read for me. A key is to offer a small sample (say the first three chapters), before asking people to commit. It's hard to commit to reading a whole book, if you don't know what it's like. (In my own experience as a beta reader for others, I've been burned by committing to a whole book without reading a sample first — so heed my warning! 😂)
Six of us were in a “Zoom” writing class offered by University of Chicago. When it broke for summer, one of us reached out to writers she admired and who had been thoughtful and generous with comments and feedback. We all write fiction — Biblical, time travel, a marriage story, etc. We meet weekly for one hour, over Zoom, and discuss one writer’s work. Typically, about 20 pages. I and another typically moderate conversation. No one talks too much. We send written comments separately. It works. I like it more than U of C class where we met; I had to read and give feedback to four writers weekly. I had too many stories in my head.